Huddling / Banding together based on race and religion is not exclusive to Malay village psychology but can be found in Britexit,Trump politics, Merkel’s Germany etc etc
It is all politics with politicians brain washing all and sundry to stay in power. The abandonment of the Malay Adat and the adoption of perceived Islamic practice, which are actually Arabic culture in disguise.
Replacements of common Malay words with Arabic terms in the last 15 or so years. Need for prayers before every damn thing – seminars, conferences meetings etc etc. these were not there 20 years ago!!
Promotion of jakim who seems to have higher authority than the “supreme” court. These are all a function of Politics in Malaysia.
To most of us living outside Thailand, Thai politics is rather confusing. Whereas Singapore, Hong Kong and Malaysia have been British colonies and English is one of the major languages, Thailand has never been a colony and its language is not easy to understand, we tend to know a lot less.
Sad comment from a coward neofascist bangkokian who will be one of the first to live thailand precipitously once the red shirts reorganized themselves and take for once and all their political destiny into their own hands…should happen in the next very few years to come, good luck to you!
Australia should be allowing indigenous Christian and another persecuted minority groups ( Hazara being one) as asylum seekers. There is difference between these people and Iranians and Shia people.
‘Afghani’ is the name of Afghanistan’s currency. ‘Afghan’ is the name given to the people of Afghanistan.
If one uses ‘Afghan’, there is not much point in introducing ethnic distinctions such as ‘Hazara’. Why rob this much-persecuted people of their national, as against their ethnic and religious, identity?
Thai politics always intrigue people outside the country. One could understand the importance of the military and the supreme respect for the sovereign. Even in Korea which had powerful military domination conceded to civilian democracy. It has not happily happened in Thailand.
First, the announced results have been counted by people who could not care less about fairness to low-caste Thais. Accurately counting the opinions of low-caste people means nothing to officials selected entirely on their ability to crawl to their superiors. On those grounds alone I would dismiss the results as highly dubious. They are what the counters’ superiors want to hear.
One of the reasons why the military are more effective rulers than the hierarchy of civilian crawlers, is the tradition that a commander be told honestly by his inferiors of conditions in the field: otherwise victory is less likely. The army, happy enough to use one set of numbers as propaganda, is sure to have its own scrutineers to provide more accurate (and secret) results. The army will want to identify allied and enemy territory. They will want to know who to flatter and protect, and who to rob and kill. A significant proportion of voters will, of course, have kept these factors in mind.
‘Absolve Islam of blame’; for what exactly? ‘Al Wala’ Wal Bara’ is not exclusionary, it means ‘refining one’s beliefs’. It is not ‘well known’ that Shia Islam is ‘outside the Islamic religion’ because…well, because it isn’t.
Anyway, Malay anxiety about economic competition would seem to be justified given the exceptional mercantile skill of the Chinese, particularly the Hokkien.
The Malay court decision on the name ‘Allah’ was indeed astonishingly stupid given that the Arab Christian use of the term predates Islam.
Again, not what this commentary even remotely states. There is no “fluency” in Islamic theology with innumerable Sunni, Shi’a and minority (Ahmadi, Ismaili, Alewi, Druze, etc) schools, regarded as heretical, but are merely successful derivatives and thus engender jealousy among mainstream Sunnis and Twelver Shi’ites, jealousy evident in recent Ahmadi communities in Malaysia and Indonesia. You are arguing with yourself. Professor Kessler is not engaging in any debates about postmodern Wahhabism, Salafism, Hanbali, Hanafi or Shaf’i Islam. I find it interesting that several Malay colleagues of mine who have read his commentary either completely agree or disagree with him. The ones that agree are those trained in scholarly studies of Malay history, Adat, culture, and intercultural practices. The ones that disagree are Imam friends of mine who support PAS and serve village suraus and mosques. They disagree because, like you, they also set up a false paradigm and think Clive is out to either smash Islam or “re-Malayize” it, so to speak and neither is the case. I don’t buy your implied argument that your presumed expertise in Islam (and evident non-expertise in Malay Studies) is more pronounced than Malay scholars themselves, or Professor Kessler’s knowledge. Your first sentence is wrong and it is also not what Professor Kessler is stating. It is your own straw man that you erect between Ketuanan Melayu at one end and Islam at the other. This is not, and has never been, a zero-sum game, which is what you are arguing….in the mirror.
The column is claiming that Malay attitudes to non-Muslims are based off of Malay psychology rather than Islam, and thus while not saying so, is evidently attempting to absolve Islam of blame.
The concept of Al-Wala’ Wal-Bara’ is inherent to Islam. If a Malay follows Islam, this is what he believes. If he doesn’t follow Islam it isn’t an issue.
Shia are outside of the Islamic religion as should be well known. We cannot really expect fluency in Islamic theology from the bashers of non-existent ‘Wahhabism’.
They are not wrong. The threat to the Western nations is from Indonesian Muslims and destroying their religious unity with LGBT propaganda against Indonesian society is a good way to wage proxy war against them. We should not be surprised at their counter-attacks.
The real issue is what happens when, as is inevitable in Indonesia’s increasing Islamically conservative environment, these 100million civilians with military training begin to join Islamic terror groups. This program is a medium term threat to regional and global security.
It is strange you should posit that they ‘becoming Indonesian’ by abandoning Salafism. (And from what I read here of them accepting democracy, which is apostasy, they are indeed abandoning it and Islam itself). There is no reason why ‘Salafism’ should be thought as of ‘un-Indonesian’ and it is far from new to Indonesia. The Padri War 1803-37 was fought by Salafists. Thus it has at least two-hundred year history.
That is a complete misinterpretation of the commentary and is in fact, an absurd comment, that is discordant with Islam, whether in Malaysia or in Morocco or in Kazakhstan. The commentary has nothing to do with blaming Islam or not blaming Islam; the column is about Malay psychology and projection, not a political commentary on the possible Wahhabization of the elite UMNO-appointed clerical Imam class, as very accurately described by Kassim Ahmad. You must be reading the weed leaves as your response is to a commentary not in visual evidence. Perhaps learning more about Malays and Malaysia will help clear the visual static. Finally, the concept of Al-Wala’ Wal-Bara’ in Islam is not inherently Malay and this commentary is not a diagenesis of the whole range of Islamic practices from Morocco to Indonesia, which include Sunni, Shi’a and smaller sects, which have no concept of Al-Wala’ Wal-Bara’. Lay of the weed, dude.
doesn’t really have anything to do with ethnic malay psychology
you are typically saying islam is only an means of expression and a manifestation rather than the cause of this behaviour
this argument is very popular among those who wish to avoid laying the blame on the Islamic religion
but islamic theology itself inherently promotes this type of exclusionary behaviour
it is the concept of al wala’ wal bara’
This is inherent to Islam and found in any race of people who practice the Islamic religion, not a product of malay cultural psychology
I think you need to consider where the real power in Thailand resides, Andrew, and therefore what people might genuinely fear: no one not resident in Thailand is worried in the least about dedicating their Facebook page and Twitter account to recreating the ambiance of a cheesy, old-fashioned, celebrity gossip column focused on any monarchy whatsoever.
On the other hand, just consider the way the “Hedda Hoppers” of the Thai monarchy would likely have dealt with the American war in Iraq for example: would a gossip-monger be likely to confront the real global power of the US government and military by exposing that shoddy affair before it became so evident even Hedda could have said something? Hardly.
The Thai military, while not on the scale of the Great Shaitan, is a powerful and often vicious organization. It’s much safer to stand on a little hill and wave photos of a prince and princess while wearing a t-shirt that says “Aren’t I just so Courageous?!?” than to confront real power in Thailand.
It’s how they got away with Iraq for so long. It’s how it goes in Thailand.
There are courageous journalists out there, but they certainly aren’t trolling social media with revelations about tattooed princes and other fascinating irrelevancies.
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‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
So do Inuit and your point is ? If this article was about German “huddling”, would point out that Malays do it too, as a Malay of course.
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
Huddling / Banding together based on race and religion is not exclusive to Malay village psychology but can be found in Britexit,Trump politics, Merkel’s Germany etc etc
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
It is all politics with politicians brain washing all and sundry to stay in power. The abandonment of the Malay Adat and the adoption of perceived Islamic practice, which are actually Arabic culture in disguise.
Replacements of common Malay words with Arabic terms in the last 15 or so years. Need for prayers before every damn thing – seminars, conferences meetings etc etc. these were not there 20 years ago!!
Promotion of jakim who seems to have higher authority than the “supreme” court. These are all a function of Politics in Malaysia.
Myanmar Update 2017 Call for Papers
We are interested in the up coming international research conference. Please give us the full details of the conference.
Thanks.
Decades of dominance and a junta’s demise
To most of us living outside Thailand, Thai politics is rather confusing. Whereas Singapore, Hong Kong and Malaysia have been British colonies and English is one of the major languages, Thailand has never been a colony and its language is not easy to understand, we tend to know a lot less.
Dim prospects for Thailand’s democracy
Sad comment from a coward neofascist bangkokian who will be one of the first to live thailand precipitously once the red shirts reorganized themselves and take for once and all their political destiny into their own hands…should happen in the next very few years to come, good luck to you!
A new way of seeing asylum seekers
Australia should be allowing indigenous Christian and another persecuted minority groups ( Hazara being one) as asylum seekers. There is difference between these people and Iranians and Shia people.
Elections without democracy in Southeast Asia
Studying authoritarianism rather than democratization might make sense.
A new way of seeing asylum seekers
‘Afghani’ is the name of Afghanistan’s currency. ‘Afghan’ is the name given to the people of Afghanistan.
If one uses ‘Afghan’, there is not much point in introducing ethnic distinctions such as ‘Hazara’. Why rob this much-persecuted people of their national, as against their ethnic and religious, identity?
Dim prospects for Thailand’s democracy
Thai politics always intrigue people outside the country. One could understand the importance of the military and the supreme respect for the sovereign. Even in Korea which had powerful military domination conceded to civilian democracy. It has not happily happened in Thailand.
Dim prospects for Thailand’s democracy
First, the announced results have been counted by people who could not care less about fairness to low-caste Thais. Accurately counting the opinions of low-caste people means nothing to officials selected entirely on their ability to crawl to their superiors. On those grounds alone I would dismiss the results as highly dubious. They are what the counters’ superiors want to hear.
One of the reasons why the military are more effective rulers than the hierarchy of civilian crawlers, is the tradition that a commander be told honestly by his inferiors of conditions in the field: otherwise victory is less likely. The army, happy enough to use one set of numbers as propaganda, is sure to have its own scrutineers to provide more accurate (and secret) results. The army will want to identify allied and enemy territory. They will want to know who to flatter and protect, and who to rob and kill. A significant proportion of voters will, of course, have kept these factors in mind.
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
‘Absolve Islam of blame’; for what exactly? ‘Al Wala’ Wal Bara’ is not exclusionary, it means ‘refining one’s beliefs’. It is not ‘well known’ that Shia Islam is ‘outside the Islamic religion’ because…well, because it isn’t.
Anyway, Malay anxiety about economic competition would seem to be justified given the exceptional mercantile skill of the Chinese, particularly the Hokkien.
The Malay court decision on the name ‘Allah’ was indeed astonishingly stupid given that the Arab Christian use of the term predates Islam.
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
Again, not what this commentary even remotely states. There is no “fluency” in Islamic theology with innumerable Sunni, Shi’a and minority (Ahmadi, Ismaili, Alewi, Druze, etc) schools, regarded as heretical, but are merely successful derivatives and thus engender jealousy among mainstream Sunnis and Twelver Shi’ites, jealousy evident in recent Ahmadi communities in Malaysia and Indonesia. You are arguing with yourself. Professor Kessler is not engaging in any debates about postmodern Wahhabism, Salafism, Hanbali, Hanafi or Shaf’i Islam. I find it interesting that several Malay colleagues of mine who have read his commentary either completely agree or disagree with him. The ones that agree are those trained in scholarly studies of Malay history, Adat, culture, and intercultural practices. The ones that disagree are Imam friends of mine who support PAS and serve village suraus and mosques. They disagree because, like you, they also set up a false paradigm and think Clive is out to either smash Islam or “re-Malayize” it, so to speak and neither is the case. I don’t buy your implied argument that your presumed expertise in Islam (and evident non-expertise in Malay Studies) is more pronounced than Malay scholars themselves, or Professor Kessler’s knowledge. Your first sentence is wrong and it is also not what Professor Kessler is stating. It is your own straw man that you erect between Ketuanan Melayu at one end and Islam at the other. This is not, and has never been, a zero-sum game, which is what you are arguing….in the mirror.
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
The column is claiming that Malay attitudes to non-Muslims are based off of Malay psychology rather than Islam, and thus while not saying so, is evidently attempting to absolve Islam of blame.
The concept of Al-Wala’ Wal-Bara’ is inherent to Islam. If a Malay follows Islam, this is what he believes. If he doesn’t follow Islam it isn’t an issue.
Shia are outside of the Islamic religion as should be well known. We cannot really expect fluency in Islamic theology from the bashers of non-existent ‘Wahhabism’.
Ryamizard’s proxy wars
They are not wrong. The threat to the Western nations is from Indonesian Muslims and destroying their religious unity with LGBT propaganda against Indonesian society is a good way to wage proxy war against them. We should not be surprised at their counter-attacks.
Living in a gangster’s paradise
The real issue is what happens when, as is inevitable in Indonesia’s increasing Islamically conservative environment, these 100million civilians with military training begin to join Islamic terror groups. This program is a medium term threat to regional and global security.
Global Salafi activism and Indonesian Islam
It is strange you should posit that they ‘becoming Indonesian’ by abandoning Salafism. (And from what I read here of them accepting democracy, which is apostasy, they are indeed abandoning it and Islam itself). There is no reason why ‘Salafism’ should be thought as of ‘un-Indonesian’ and it is far from new to Indonesia. The Padri War 1803-37 was fought by Salafists. Thus it has at least two-hundred year history.
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
That is a complete misinterpretation of the commentary and is in fact, an absurd comment, that is discordant with Islam, whether in Malaysia or in Morocco or in Kazakhstan. The commentary has nothing to do with blaming Islam or not blaming Islam; the column is about Malay psychology and projection, not a political commentary on the possible Wahhabization of the elite UMNO-appointed clerical Imam class, as very accurately described by Kassim Ahmad. You must be reading the weed leaves as your response is to a commentary not in visual evidence. Perhaps learning more about Malays and Malaysia will help clear the visual static. Finally, the concept of Al-Wala’ Wal-Bara’ in Islam is not inherently Malay and this commentary is not a diagenesis of the whole range of Islamic practices from Morocco to Indonesia, which include Sunni, Shi’a and smaller sects, which have no concept of Al-Wala’ Wal-Bara’. Lay of the weed, dude.
‘Deep’ Malay cultural psychology
doesn’t really have anything to do with ethnic malay psychology
you are typically saying islam is only an means of expression and a manifestation rather than the cause of this behaviour
this argument is very popular among those who wish to avoid laying the blame on the Islamic religion
but islamic theology itself inherently promotes this type of exclusionary behaviour
it is the concept of al wala’ wal bara’
This is inherent to Islam and found in any race of people who practice the Islamic religion, not a product of malay cultural psychology
Private: ‘Excuse me, Emperor …’
I think you need to consider where the real power in Thailand resides, Andrew, and therefore what people might genuinely fear: no one not resident in Thailand is worried in the least about dedicating their Facebook page and Twitter account to recreating the ambiance of a cheesy, old-fashioned, celebrity gossip column focused on any monarchy whatsoever.
On the other hand, just consider the way the “Hedda Hoppers” of the Thai monarchy would likely have dealt with the American war in Iraq for example: would a gossip-monger be likely to confront the real global power of the US government and military by exposing that shoddy affair before it became so evident even Hedda could have said something? Hardly.
The Thai military, while not on the scale of the Great Shaitan, is a powerful and often vicious organization. It’s much safer to stand on a little hill and wave photos of a prince and princess while wearing a t-shirt that says “Aren’t I just so Courageous?!?” than to confront real power in Thailand.
It’s how they got away with Iraq for so long. It’s how it goes in Thailand.
There are courageous journalists out there, but they certainly aren’t trolling social media with revelations about tattooed princes and other fascinating irrelevancies.