Of course there are some well-off farmers but as a percentage of the well-off it is not through farming that they make their money and it is probably misleading to describe them as “farmers”…….when I point out strictly enforced I should have added mourners are strongly encouraged to dress in a somber manner. However, just one point: why refer to females or males who provide sexual services in return for monetary payment or something similar as prostitutes? I thought in this “day-and-age” the enlightened, which I presume you are would at least describe such persons as sex workers.
James an audacious and imaginative application of Deleuze. Fascism Thai style is the question, how the king-image is used in Monarchy Nation Religion to incite violent desire and intolerance of dissent and difference. Thailand has never been liberal and had a democratic polity, although there have been times 1973-76 of different freedoms. Thailand a black hole indeed for thinking and being a human free from Thainess.
Although the section dealing with royalty in the many constitutions Thailand has had seems to be inviolate, there was one small change made in one of them (sorry, can’t remember which year) that apparently the king himself inserted, which says that a woman can become monarch. That seemed to indicate a possibility for Sirindhorn. Of course, a good number of years ago, and perhaps preferences changed during the interim, but I see no one even mentioning that clause.
Shane, I’m not sure how many of the people I’ve spoken to during the past few days are farmers or prostitutes, and I doubt the degree to which these professional categories are useful to assess their financial status. Recent research indicates that it may be a mistake to think of farmers as Thailand’s poor. Indeed, it is the elites themselves who keep on portraying them as such.
For that reason, I question your claim that ‘farmers’ do not have enough money to travel to Bangkok and to buy black clothes. It may apply to some, but I wouldn’t generalize.
I disagree with your claim that the dress code is ‘strictly enforced’ at Sanam Luang. Some people wear black out of respect, and others do so because they don’t want to be deemed disrespectful/immoral – most possibly for both reasons. Stigmatizing those who do not wear black is a form of violence, which should be denounced. So far, there has nevertheless been no authority enforcing any dress code there – strictly or otherwise.
Apologies for getting your name wrong. Was reading from my mobile.
A few hundred people, perhaps even a few thousand (say 0.005% of all Thai people), decided last week to become the experts in mourning. For lack of a better phrase, they appointed themselves as Mourning Police (MPs).
Clearly superior to all other Thais including government and actual experts on royalty, the MPs have served the nation for 10 days, and counting, by finding and shaming lesser subjects who weren’t mourning correctly.
Well from the Junta point of view it is a very useful tool to create a divine king narrative as you can shape it as you wish and the king lives on, thus providing the most perfect object of respect and reverence rhat cannot be embodied in an earthly king.
So I expect we will see a lot more of this, and perhaps a few miracles along the way, so as to cement this new image into the lives of the proletariat.
The king is dead, long live the king, indeed.
Good article. In a future version you might want to include more about your informants so readers not accustomed to anthropology can figure out whose ideas you are relating.
Edoardo: I assume when you addressed Sarah you referred to me…no problem I can be Sarah or whoever but is the “and so on” the Other or Others….but I do have one further question for you: how many of the people you have talked to during the funerary rituals are actually farmers, workers or yes indeed perhaps bar workers? I have talked to some people, and yes some of them hail from upcountry but primarily provincial towns. Village-based farmers cannot generally afford to travel to Bangkok and purchase the black clothing that is required, of which the wearing in and around the funerary sites is strictly enforced.
Indeed, this was my first thought. How many people will reject this vision of a divine king? And how will these very different and impossible to reconcile visions play out in the future?
Thank you, Sarah. The article is based entirely on the cosmological narratives of ordinary people.
In the first part, I highlight precisely that there are many cosmologies in Thai society, which differ from the models proposed by state-promoted ancient cosmological treaties.
In the second part, I talk about what I have observed since the passing of the king. I have spoken with people from all walks of life in the past few days at the Grand Palace – including people from the provinces, who spend the night sleeping on the grounds of Sanam Luang.
America as a country is a disappointment too according to some people. As is russia. China. Their rulers dont care about that… The thai people get what they deserve. Their uniformity and constant bowing to elite’s laws makes them a nation of sheep. Being different here is dangerous but no pain no gain… how many critical thai have we heard sofar?
Very interesting article but one very simple question from a simpleton: I see no mention of farmers, workers or even bar girls in the plurality of voices and is this because the author – an anthropologist – does not privilege the views of such people? Reading the narrative as a simpleton it does seem to me that the author has not – to use the BS that post-modernists are apt to talk about when “privileging” the voice/s of the other/s – taken “ordinary” Thai cosmological knowledge into account. Or has he concluded they have nothing if substance in this respect?
Not a bad article, but the comparison between the buffoon Trump and the vengeful, vindictive, and depraved CP does not quite fit the reality, although there are a couple of overlaps as Christine points clearly points out. I must emphasize that the CP is in a whole different category for a number of well known and not well known (thanks to the heavy handed enforcement of Article 1120 in Thailand) antics.
I thought I had seen it all or heard it all, but when I saw the skimpy outfit the CP wore at the airport, and walking around shamelessly in a german mall, I was aghast and had to shake my head in sadness. No matter how much time and effort the Thai royalists and sophisticated palace PR machine work tirelessly to present a “good image” of the CP and the Thai royal family, the CP is out of control, lost all sense of shame, and has the audacity to flaunt it too, knowing that the a photojournalist (as in the case of Bild) would somehow, somewhere take pics and post it online for the entire world to see. Then the illegitimate military junta goes on the offensive and full scale witch hunt for the perpetrators of those who posted it online and the discussion on social media sites. The genie is out of the bottle as the saying goes, and no matter how much they or anyone tries to block it, or threaten with 112, somehow word gets out sooner or later and the Thai people talk about it on social media sites.
CP is a ticking time bomb and it will a sad story how his life ends, a wasted life indeed, when he could have done so much good for Thailand and left behind a legacy worth remembering. What he has sown, he will definitely reap, and is already reaping, as we see this sad spectacle unfolding before our eyes.
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The return of the divine king
Of course there are some well-off farmers but as a percentage of the well-off it is not through farming that they make their money and it is probably misleading to describe them as “farmers”…….when I point out strictly enforced I should have added mourners are strongly encouraged to dress in a somber manner. However, just one point: why refer to females or males who provide sexual services in return for monetary payment or something similar as prostitutes? I thought in this “day-and-age” the enlightened, which I presume you are would at least describe such persons as sex workers.
Thailand’s black hole: a Deleuzian take
Black sheep in a black New World
Thailand’s black hole: a Deleuzian take
Huh?
Thailand’s black hole: a Deleuzian take
James an audacious and imaginative application of Deleuze. Fascism Thai style is the question, how the king-image is used in Monarchy Nation Religion to incite violent desire and intolerance of dissent and difference. Thailand has never been liberal and had a democratic polity, although there have been times 1973-76 of different freedoms. Thailand a black hole indeed for thinking and being a human free from Thainess.
Thailand’s black hole: a Deleuzian take
Thailand is not a favorite place for foreign investors.
What’s going on in Thailand?
Although the section dealing with royalty in the many constitutions Thailand has had seems to be inviolate, there was one small change made in one of them (sorry, can’t remember which year) that apparently the king himself inserted, which says that a woman can become monarch. That seemed to indicate a possibility for Sirindhorn. Of course, a good number of years ago, and perhaps preferences changed during the interim, but I see no one even mentioning that clause.
Mourning and the Thai interregnum
Not. Do your research.
The return of the divine king
Interesting indeed Edoardo. I refer to :
” some elements of ‘traditional’ cosmological understandings of divine kingship to make a dramatic return ”
This is, IMO impossible in the long run and we know why. Unless that is…
Of course you are asking the question, not suggesting the answer.
The current military leadership will be hard put to do anything but emphasize the human, rather than the divine. Again, we know why.
Why King Vajiralongkorn will be good for Thai Democracy
Thailand 2016 = Cambodia circa late sixties. Hope I am wrong.
The return of the divine king
Shane, I’m not sure how many of the people I’ve spoken to during the past few days are farmers or prostitutes, and I doubt the degree to which these professional categories are useful to assess their financial status. Recent research indicates that it may be a mistake to think of farmers as Thailand’s poor. Indeed, it is the elites themselves who keep on portraying them as such.
For that reason, I question your claim that ‘farmers’ do not have enough money to travel to Bangkok and to buy black clothes. It may apply to some, but I wouldn’t generalize.
I disagree with your claim that the dress code is ‘strictly enforced’ at Sanam Luang. Some people wear black out of respect, and others do so because they don’t want to be deemed disrespectful/immoral – most possibly for both reasons. Stigmatizing those who do not wear black is a form of violence, which should be denounced. So far, there has nevertheless been no authority enforcing any dress code there – strictly or otherwise.
Apologies for getting your name wrong. Was reading from my mobile.
The cult of a dead king
Bkk Post has an excellent Opinion piece by ALAN DAWSON here :
http://m.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/1117193/the-big-issue-whine-stewards
just a snippet ….
A few hundred people, perhaps even a few thousand (say 0.005% of all Thai people), decided last week to become the experts in mourning. For lack of a better phrase, they appointed themselves as Mourning Police (MPs).
Clearly superior to all other Thais including government and actual experts on royalty, the MPs have served the nation for 10 days, and counting, by finding and shaming lesser subjects who weren’t mourning correctly.
well worth a read imho .
The return of the divine king
Well from the Junta point of view it is a very useful tool to create a divine king narrative as you can shape it as you wish and the king lives on, thus providing the most perfect object of respect and reverence rhat cannot be embodied in an earthly king.
So I expect we will see a lot more of this, and perhaps a few miracles along the way, so as to cement this new image into the lives of the proletariat.
The king is dead, long live the king, indeed.
The return of the divine king
Good article. In a future version you might want to include more about your informants so readers not accustomed to anthropology can figure out whose ideas you are relating.
The return of the divine king
Edoardo: I assume when you addressed Sarah you referred to me…no problem I can be Sarah or whoever but is the “and so on” the Other or Others….but I do have one further question for you: how many of the people you have talked to during the funerary rituals are actually farmers, workers or yes indeed perhaps bar workers? I have talked to some people, and yes some of them hail from upcountry but primarily provincial towns. Village-based farmers cannot generally afford to travel to Bangkok and purchase the black clothing that is required, of which the wearing in and around the funerary sites is strictly enforced.
The return of the divine king
Indeed, this was my first thought. How many people will reject this vision of a divine king? And how will these very different and impossible to reconcile visions play out in the future?
The return of the divine king
Thank you, Sarah. The article is based entirely on the cosmological narratives of ordinary people.
In the first part, I highlight precisely that there are many cosmologies in Thai society, which differ from the models proposed by state-promoted ancient cosmological treaties.
In the second part, I talk about what I have observed since the passing of the king. I have spoken with people from all walks of life in the past few days at the Grand Palace – including people from the provinces, who spend the night sleeping on the grounds of Sanam Luang.
The return of the divine king
I appreciate what you say, but there is nothing in support of divine kingship in what I wrote.
This is an attempt to make sense of how divine kingship may have changed and may be changing historically.
Thailand’s law of the mob
America as a country is a disappointment too according to some people. As is russia. China. Their rulers dont care about that… The thai people get what they deserve. Their uniformity and constant bowing to elite’s laws makes them a nation of sheep. Being different here is dangerous but no pain no gain… how many critical thai have we heard sofar?
The return of the divine king
Very interesting article but one very simple question from a simpleton: I see no mention of farmers, workers or even bar girls in the plurality of voices and is this because the author – an anthropologist – does not privilege the views of such people? Reading the narrative as a simpleton it does seem to me that the author has not – to use the BS that post-modernists are apt to talk about when “privileging” the voice/s of the other/s – taken “ordinary” Thai cosmological knowledge into account. Or has he concluded they have nothing if substance in this respect?
Magic families
Not a bad article, but the comparison between the buffoon Trump and the vengeful, vindictive, and depraved CP does not quite fit the reality, although there are a couple of overlaps as Christine points clearly points out. I must emphasize that the CP is in a whole different category for a number of well known and not well known (thanks to the heavy handed enforcement of Article 1120 in Thailand) antics.
I thought I had seen it all or heard it all, but when I saw the skimpy outfit the CP wore at the airport, and walking around shamelessly in a german mall, I was aghast and had to shake my head in sadness. No matter how much time and effort the Thai royalists and sophisticated palace PR machine work tirelessly to present a “good image” of the CP and the Thai royal family, the CP is out of control, lost all sense of shame, and has the audacity to flaunt it too, knowing that the a photojournalist (as in the case of Bild) would somehow, somewhere take pics and post it online for the entire world to see. Then the illegitimate military junta goes on the offensive and full scale witch hunt for the perpetrators of those who posted it online and the discussion on social media sites. The genie is out of the bottle as the saying goes, and no matter how much they or anyone tries to block it, or threaten with 112, somehow word gets out sooner or later and the Thai people talk about it on social media sites.
CP is a ticking time bomb and it will a sad story how his life ends, a wasted life indeed, when he could have done so much good for Thailand and left behind a legacy worth remembering. What he has sown, he will definitely reap, and is already reaping, as we see this sad spectacle unfolding before our eyes.